DUST Search - Skill tree fix doesn't fix all suit issues

J-Lewis wrote:

Iron Wolf Saber wrote:

I agree the tree is not the end all fix but its a start of the fixes.

As for the roles needing their racial basics is that Dust 514 has simplified to be branching linear in progression. So no more 2 into 1s are possible anymore. This was done for the sake of FPS players that may or may not understand the entire Root-branching tree that Eve online enjoys where ships can has as many as 3 requirements and each of those have 3 apiece.

I believe it to be a misconception that FPS players that caught onto DUST find multiple prerequisites too complicated; I believe most of us play the game because we want something deeper, more meaningful, and more complex than the generic shooter of any particular year (we're definitely not here because of good shooter mechanics).
Linear progression for skills is a damn shame, because it requires so many "dead" skills; what we like to call SP sinks. For instance, there wasn't actually anything wrong with Weaponry giving a 10% damage bonus, in fact, it encouraged people to train for heavy weaponry because it was such a good skill, and once you had it to 5, heavy weapons was just around the corner. The "oh it's a mandatory skill, we should just give it to everyone" mindset is a huge mistake; it can be extrapolated to apply to any flavor of the month skill.

The issue is not any particular SP cost or level requirement for a skill; it's that many of the more SP intensive skills give no real benefit (e.g. all skills that just unlock things). There is no incentive to train Weaponry beyond 3 if you're not going Heavy. This is a mistake because the skill tree should be encouraging players to branch out into multiple roles over time; and having the specializations so far apart is both discouraging and counterproductive to this.

Something the EVE skill tree does well is make you realize how close you actually are to the next thing you might want; it keeps whispering in your ear that if you just deviate from your plan for a couple of days, you'll be able to do something else on the side: "Phew! I can finally fly Minmatar Bombers after 2 months of training what's next- oh hey, if I just put 9 days aside I can also fly Caldari Bombers! And they both use missiles! ... And then if I train another frigate specialization, I'll also be able to fly both of those! Awesome!". Bombers and Assault ships might not have much in common role wise, but having done 3/4 of the training for them beforehand is a huge incentive to branch into both.


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Draco Cerberus Purgatorium of the Damned League of Infamy 52	Posted - 2013.05.22 18:40:00 - [1] - Quote J-Lewis wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I agree the tree is not the end all fix but its a start of the fixes. As for the roles needing their racial basics is that Dust 514 has simplified to be branching linear in progression. So no more 2 into 1s are possible anymore. This was done for the sake of FPS players that may or may not understand the entire Root-branching tree that Eve online enjoys where ships can has as many as 3 requirements and each of those have 3 apiece. I believe it to be a misconception that FPS players that caught onto DUST find multiple prerequisites too complicated; I believe most of us play the game because we want something deeper, more meaningful, and more complex than the generic shooter of any particular year (we're definitely not here because of good shooter mechanics). Linear progression for skills is a damn shame, because it requires so many "dead" skills; what we like to call SP sinks. For instance, there wasn't actually anything wrong with Weaponry giving a 10% damage bonus, in fact, it encouraged people to train for heavy weaponry because it was such a good skill, and once you had it to 5, heavy weapons was just around the corner. The "oh it's a mandatory skill, we should just give it to everyone" mindset is a huge mistake; it can be extrapolated to apply to any flavor of the month skill. The issue is not any particular SP cost or level requirement for a skill; it's that many of the more SP intensive skills give no real benefit (e.g. all skills that just unlock things). There is no incentive to train Weaponry beyond 3 if you're not going Heavy. This is a mistake because the skill tree should be encouraging players to branch out into multiple roles over time; and having the specializations so far apart is both discouraging and counterproductive to this. Something the EVE skill tree does well is make you realize how close you actually are to the next thing you might want; it keeps whispering in your ear that if you just deviate from your plan for a couple of days, you'll be able to do something else on the side: "Phew! I can finally fly Minmatar Bombers after 2 months of training what's next- oh hey, if I just put 9 days aside I can also fly Caldari Bombers! And they both use missiles! ... And then if I train another frigate specialization, I'll also be able to fly both of those! Awesome!". Bombers and Assault ships might not have much in common role wise, but having done 3/4 of the training for them beforehand is a huge incentive to branch into both. Indeed, having no benefit from the general dropsuit command and requirements for many items not giving any bonus to how well they operate is a huge deal. Most of the battles with timers take less than a 3rd of the time allotted to complete because we now lack those bonuses from skills that we had last build. Average match time for an ambush 4:23 approximately.